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View Full Version : Cyrenaica, Cyrene, Hadrian/ Zeus-Ammon , help!!


Salem
Sep 13, 2009, 10:19 PM
Dear Members
I have this coin from north Africa, Cyrene mint 2.98 gm, 19mm, HADRIANUS AUGUSTUS; Hadrian left / COS III , Zeus Ammon left.
any referance plz?
all the best
Salem

bpmurphy
Sep 13, 2009, 10:26 PM
RIC pg. 428, note; BMCRE pg. 441, note

Barry Murphy

Salem
Sep 13, 2009, 11:47 PM
Thanks alot Barry :)

AncientDave
Sep 14, 2009, 10:57 AM
Nice coin, I have been looking for one of these...............:D

cckk
Oct 28, 2009, 06:42 PM
Is it known for certain that this issue is from cyrene? I have usually seen this assigned to caesarea in cappadocia ala sydenham 289.

Another example:
http://www.cngcoins.com/Coin.aspx?CoinID=142211

There also used to be an exquisite example in coinarchives from 2007:
numismatica ars classica 40, lot 716

Roma_Orbis
Oct 29, 2009, 02:35 AM
There also used to be an exquisite example in coinarchives from 2007:
numismatica ars classica 40, lot 716

http://www.acsearch.info/record.html?id=43869

I like the description "Two magnificent portraits of superb Hellenistic style" and identified as "Quadrans". There is nothing of especially hellenistic style of engraving, this type is evidently struck by the Rome mint for use in the East (Syria ?) in yellow bronze metal, thus, because of the area of circulation and metal content, it is certainly not a quadrans denomination, but a Greek imperial one.
=> Salem, does this coin come from Syria or around?

Ah, Dave, we're on the same market :D

Jérôme

Jacktat
Oct 29, 2009, 08:41 AM
The type has been found at Cyrene. For example:
Buttrey TV. Part I: The Coins from the Sanctuary of Demeter and Persephone. in White D (Ed). Extramural Sanctuary of Demeter and Persephone at Cyrene Libya, Final Reports: Vol. VI. page 28. Philadelphia. 1997.
Dr. Buttrey lists the denomination of semis (~3.5 gms) & quadrans (~2.7 gms) for coins of Hadrian. Coins with a similar reverse were also found for Trajan and Marcus Aurelius.
A total of 17 (3 of Hadrian) coins with this reverse were cataloged from the excavation.
Cyrene was thriving at this time (2nd Century CE), but the coins may have been imported.

Sydenham attributed the type to Caeseraea in Cappadocia. Does anyone know if the type has been found outside Cyrenaica?

John Tatman

Roma_Orbis
Oct 29, 2009, 10:30 AM
For me, this is a typical Eastern coinage, for which exact city/territory I don't know. A summary of all finds would be welcome to determine that, as generally coinage tends to stay more or less in the area of first circulation. The fact that some coin has been found in Cyrene doesn't prove that it was in circulation there. Some colonial coins were indeed found (rarely though) e.g. in France (Gaul) or Bath in GB, while emitted thousands of kilometers away.

Jérôme

AncientDave
Oct 29, 2009, 10:57 AM
http://www.acsearch.info/record.html?id=43869

I like the description "Two magnificent portraits of superb Hellenistic style" and identified as "Quadrans". There is nothing of especially hellenistic style of engraving, this type is evidently struck by the Rome mint for use in the East (Syria ?) in yellow bronze metal, thus, because of the area of circulation and metal content, it is certainly not a quadrans denomination, but a Greek imperial one.
=> Salem, does this coin come from Syria or around?

Ah, Dave, we're on the same market :D

Jérôme

Indeed we are, my friend. I cannot tell you how much time I have spent drooling over your coins. :D

Roma_Orbis
Oct 29, 2009, 11:05 AM
Indeed we are, my friend. I cannot tell you how much time I have spent drooling over your coins. :D

Ah, tempting to steal my secrets, do you mean I now have to hide them, or should I add in my gallery, the ones still to be photographed? ;)

Jérôme

Jacktat
Oct 29, 2009, 11:36 AM
The fact that some coin has been found in Cyrene doesn't prove that it was in circulation there.

Jérôme - Let's see - several of these coin types spanning almost a century have been found at documented excavations. Not sure what additional evidence you would need to "prove" circulation. I think style may have been what led Sydenham to have originally attributed the coins to Cappadocia. As far as I know, most coins of this type have been found at Cyrene.

However, it is possible that the type may have been produced for use elsewhere, but "migrated" to Cyrenaica because of the presumed popularity of the reverse type with Jupiter Ammon. Is there any stronger proof of circulation at another location?

John

Roma_Orbis
Oct 29, 2009, 12:10 PM
John,

Rome has struck large series of bronzes for the East, notably Syria province since at least between Vespasian and Hadrian. See for example:

3152

3154

3153
3155

The last one is the type in question, so you can compare the style. Style is not provincial but from the mint of Rome.

About a possible area of circulation being Cyrene in Libya: as far as I know, imperial coinage was used from Libya to Morocco in Africa. Why such a type existing only as small bronze (thus should be a semis, and certainly not a quadrans, in copper), and not other denominations much more used as the As? More, there is no SC on reverse, as would bear regular bronze denominations.

So a kind of tessera for special purpose, as the small bronze series without SC struck for the mines in Illyria (Dardanici, Metal Delm, Pinciana, etc ...) and found there?

I think only a comprehensive survey of the find spots can give some answer to this.

Jérôme